How EDL leader misled BBC about attacks on Muslims


8:55 am - June 12th 2013

by Sunny Hundal    


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Yesterday the Today programme aired an interview with the English Defence League’s ‘Tommy Robinson’ (his adopted but not real name).

The interview was criticised for too being soft on the leader of the far-right group.

British Future’s Sunder Katwala went further and suggested Today’s Sarah Montague could have done more work learning about his background, such as his convictions!

But in the interview yesterday, Tommy Robinson contradicted what he has said in the past. If journalists aren’t going to do their homework, Liberal Conspiracy is here to help them.

Here was the key exchange yesterday:

Montague: So if any EDL member was found to be involved in any attack on any Muslim in this country, you would utterly condemn it …

Robinson: Utterly condemn it. Disgraceful. Every single speech I’ve give[n] since Woolwich – in fact, in the last four years – condemn any acts of violence, so the only way to solve to this is through democratic process, through peacefully protesting.

But this is at odds with what Robinson has said in the past – where he explicitly warns and holds ALL British Muslims responsible for terrorist attacks.

In the video below, he says:

EVERY SINGLE MUSLIM watching this on Youtube, on 7/7 you got away with killing and maiming British citizens, you got away with it. You had better understand that we have built a network from one end of this country to the other end, and we will not tolerate it, and the Islamic community will feel the full force of the English Defence League if we see any of our citizens killed, maimed or hurt on British soil ever again.

You can see why an EDL member might hear that and attack Muslims after Woolwich.

And yet Robinson claims he condemns such attacks. I hope the next journalist interviewing Tommy Robinson asks him about what he said.

The full speech from the Tower Hamlets march in 2011.

UPDATE
Here’s a video of EDL member singing “You burn a poppy, we burn your mosques”

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About the author
Sunny Hundal is editor of LC. Also: on Twitter, at Pickled Politics and Guardian CIF.
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Reader comments


But what the Koran says about us Kafirs is far worse than this.

Double standards, no?

2. So Much For Subtlety

The Qu’ran? A rather large number of Muslims say worse things about non-Muslims but if it is not an actual and direct threat of violence, it is usually played down.

The double standard is absurd.

3. the a&e charge nurse

‘You can see why an EDL member might hear that and attack Muslims after Woolwich’ – yes, Tommy’s work becomes harder when soldiers are not being beheaded on the streets of London, or when suicide bombers are not lurking on the travel network.

Still, continue to weep for a fantastical, fanatical religious ideology if it makes you happy – at the same time ensure repetitive coverage to the ‘United Peoples of Luton’, all 25 of them.

4. TorquilMacneil

Hang on, wasn’t there a long article on LC after the Woolwich murder lecturing us on taking thuggish extremists at their word? Surely if Mr Robinson keeps saying this stuff we have to accept it? Or does that only work when the subject is ‘British foreign policy’?

@1

“But what the Koran says about us Kafirs is far worse than this.”.

Are you seriously suggesting that the EDL carries on attacking on anyone who “looks like a Muslim”? Because it looks to me like you’re excusing their behaviour, which you justify by claiming the “Koran” is somehow worse.

Over to you.

@buddyhell

Absolutely not. I am not excusing anything. In fact, exactly the opposite. What I tried to say, probably too concisely, is that it seems harsh to criticise an interview about the reaction to Greenwich without acknowledging the ideology of jihad.

Well, the Today programme certainly balanced this with the patronising round table discussion I listened to the other morning.

In this the po-faced host held a discussion about the increasing level of support for the EDL among the white working class. The causes were quickly identified as austerity, the loss of proletarian jobs and the irrational fear of an alien culture among the not very bright.

The solutions, for the participants in the discussion, were equally obvious- more education, greater community engagement and the use of the media to get the message across that Islamic extremism is not a real threat.

The worst element of all this was the unstated assumption, among the participants, that it could never have crossed the mind of anyone listening to the discussion that those opposing the spread of Islam might, conceivably, have a valid argument.

The ignorant and unhappy drones just needed to be shown the light, persuaded that their views were aberrant, and all would be well.

No wonder people get angry.

8. Baton Rouge

`…that it could never have crossed the mind of anyone listening to the discussion that those opposing the spread of Islam might, conceivably, have a valid argument.’

All religions are unsavoury for me from Judaism, Islam, Christianity, Hinduism, Buhdism and all the rest of the self-serving and delusional crap. However I believe, being a democrat, in Freedom of Religion. That is in peoples’ right to believe what they like and practise their beliefs unmolested as long as they don’t impinge on the rights of others and I don’t identify the vast bulk of believers with those few who use it for sectarian political ends be they Islamists, Zionists or Christian Fundamentalists. The spread of religion is best opposed not through sectarian pogromist violence aimed at a particular community in the opportunist hope that you will somehow be propelled into power by it but by takling the underlying conditions that make people think they’d be better off dead. In other words by being a socialist not a fascist.

Socialists make me think I would be better off dead..

@6 shrugged

“What I tried to say, probably too concisely, is that it seems harsh to criticise an interview about the reaction to Greenwich without acknowledging the ideology of jihad”.

“The ideology of jihad” sounds a little ideologically loaded to me. You suggested that the Quran was “worse” than the EDL and now you’re back-peddling.

11. the a&e charge nurse

[10] ‘You suggested that the Quran was “worse” than the EDL’ – well it is certainly more confusing – for some it is a religion of peace, for others it is about cutting peoples head off.

As a matter of interest which islamic country do you think epitomises all that is best about this form of indoctrination – are you a fan of sharia for example?

@4 Not exactly, there was a long article saying that if an extremist claims they’re actions were motivated by something, then that’s probably what motivates them. In this instance I have no qualms with accepting the EDL is motived by concerns over Islam, whatever forms those concerns or actions thereupon might take.

@buddyhell

No I am not back-peddling. I don’t think that the EDL have ever beheaded anyone in the name of anything.

Jihad is an ideology, no?

Enough now.

@12 ‘Their actions’ not “they’re” ya silly twat.

I disagree with the OP. The Today Programme isn’t the right kind of format for rigorous cross examining of something like the EDL.
The time is too short, and that kind of badgering – like we so obviously saw when the BNP leader went on Question Time – only results in the frustration of allowing things to become clearer. I think it’s good that the listeners of Today had the chance to hear the EDL without them UAF twats shouting ”fascist scum off our streets” all over it. The listeners will be able to make up their own minds. Unless you think they are all stupid and need the be steered in the right way of thinking on such issues.
Tommy Robbinson comes across pretty much as he seems.
A bit of a football hooligan who is ”fed up” with certain sections of people in the country taking the micky. And he and his followers react in that lumpen bone-headed way. Why people get so upset about the EDL I really have no idea. They are part of the lumpen working class. Maybe if you never mix with such people they seem so alien and horrid. But if you’ve ever worked on a building site (for example) you would have come across a lot of these kinds of people. Or if you went to football matches or went to the bookmakers shop.
They are Sun and Daily Star readers. We might wish they ceased to exist – but they have always been with us.

16. margin4error

Shrugged and A&E

One could argue that the spread of any religion is bad for humanity – as would be the widespread belief in aliens and pixies at the end of the garden – because it separates people from rational thinking, and that in turn opens up a world of idiocy, ignorance and at time devastatingly awful behaviour and decision-making.

But even if one does argue that and completely overlook how much happiness such fairytales bring people – it surely doesn’t in turn mean the solution is thus to attack the adherents of one particular fairy tale does it?

Because the EDL seem to think that that is the answer – or at least their leader seems to.

17. Churm Rincewind

@ 1: For an alternative view of the Koran’s teaching on this point, see http://www.islamforpeace.org/quran.html.

In the meantime, you may like to note what the Bible has to say about non-believers (Deuteronomy 17): “If there be found any among you that…have gone and served other gods…then thou shalt…stone them with stones, until they die”.

18. margin4error

@17

Fortunately for those of us who serve no god – that very Christian passage does rather leave us free to not worry.

19. the a&e charge nurse

[16] ‘it surely doesn’t in turn mean the solution is thus to attack the adherents of one particular fairy tale does it?’ – I think we are obliged to attack these ideas intellectually, unless one prefers to be complicit with chauvinism or other forms of religious intolerance.

Of course some have to be careful because the consequences of producing various books, films or cartoons can be very serious indeed if it is not acceptable to the religion of peace.

‘A woman with a young child also screamed out to the assailant, begging him to stop. He listened to neither appeal, but instead produced a long sharpened knife and proceeded to slit van Gogh’s throat so deeply that his head was almost severed. One witness described the young man as behaving with the methodical detachment of ‘a butcher’. His final act was to affix a five-page letter to the corpse by plunging another knife into van Gogh’s chest. It was addressed to Ayaan Hirsi Ali, a Dutch MP from Somalia who had collaborated with van Gogh on Submission, a film that suggested that the Koran sanctioned domestic violence’.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/theobserver/2004/dec/05/features.magazine77

Mehdi Hasan is a bit annoyed that the EDL leader wasn’t asked a lot of tough questions too.

Ten Questions That Sarah Montague Could Have Asked The EDL’s Tommy Robinson

As I said, first there isn’t time on that kind of radio programme – where each subject gets about three minutes and people are forever being hurried up, interupted and cut off, because it’s time for the news or the next item. That’s no way to discuss issues as complex as these.

Focusing on the EDL or one person in particular is also missing the point somewhat IMO – but that’s how the spin works.
The EDL are what they are. You don’t have to be particularly clever to work out that they are somewhat knuckle dragging. If you don’t know that yet, then perhaps you should do a little homework. Just looking at some Youtubes of their demos should be enough.

The left insult us all with continuing to bang on about the EDL all the time …. it’s been a few years now and they will not let up on it. They also won’t debate as to why they keep going with this EDL uber-hype. I have asked why a few times … and been told to get lost by mods on sites like this. They won’t do it, it’s just ”Fascists – Nazis” all day long. Year after year now.

When really it’s just a tribal thing. The lumpen white tribe get really wound up by the (quite high) number of Islamists and Salafists that are now living in England. Dozens and dozens of mosques invite really dodgy speakers, or are run by backward primitave people and sects. Maybe Mehdi Hasan could spend a bit more time worrying about that.

Even here in Gloucester, every time I go to ASDA I see women wearing niqab face coverings. If I was paranoid, I might think they were the same ones that knock about with Anjem Choudary. It would be a silly assumption to make, but that’s what people can be like. If you’re a bit thick already, you could easily fall into that way of thinking.

By all means put the EDL under the microscope, and don’t give them an easy ride. But at the same time, where is the scrutiny of the UAF, whose demo one of the Woolwich butchers actually spoke at, and whose demos often contain supporters of Choudary and other Islamofascists, carrying banners declaring Islamic domination which seem to give the ‘anti-fascists’ of the UAF absolutely no cause for concern whatsoever. UAF are a large part of the problem, and their tactics have appeared to include trying to play off Muslim youth against the EDL. All they have helped do is entrench hsotility on both sides.

The BBC, Hope Not Hate and oter supposedly impartial organisations would do well to turn some of they attention they luducrous turned on UKIP after the killings to one of the main players in this, the extremely dodgy UAF. They’ve not had merely an easy ride, they haven’t even been asked to show their ticket. and one of their followers is a murderer at the centre of all this.

22. margin4error

A&E

It is fine to criticize the obvious flaws in the various religious texts. As Stan in South Park cynically points out to the Mormon family down the road “So, you know what the Book of Mormon says, and you STILL believe in it?”

That is as true a sentiment for all of the other religious texts too (they are all absurd and flawed and at times just plain awful too).

But that hardly serves as a reason not to condemn those who would vilify the followers of any one faith or another, to the point of encouraging violent action against them.

Pointing out how terrible the EDL are hardly means one thinks the Bibles or the Koran are some how a sensible basis for a global faith. They are all absurdly stupid and vicious, and so is the EDL.

23. John Reid

Comments 1-4 and Damon well said, and no sign of SMFS, finishing off this article

24. John Reid

The huff grin post article was twaddle, especially Labour prospective member Penny saying that the BBC was out of touch for letting him talk, when Ed miliband got loonies like Diane Abbott , Karen buck in the shadow cabinet

Medhi talked crap too calling em neo nazis,and saying that Robinson should give proof that it was Muslims that wrote the Letts EDL next to the burnt down mosque, he doesn’t have to do that,it’s for the police to prove, he’s quick to jump to conclusions, slower to apologise when wrong,

Mr Cattle,

25. Shatterface

Mehdi Hasan is a bit annoyed that the EDL leader wasn’t asked a lot of tough questions too.

I don’t think anyone who dismisses non-believers as ‘cattle’ has a useful contribution to make.

Hasan is the flipside of the EDL; a loudmouth bigot who gets far too much press attention.

(There isn’t, yet, an equal but oposite non-Muslim flipside to the kind of extremists we saw acting in Woolwich.)

26. the a&e charge nurse

[22] nobody would put Sam Harris, the Dawk or Christopher Hitchens in the same category as the EDL – it is too tedious to point out the EDL are simply a tiny minority who agitate on the margin on certain forms of certain forms of social disaffection, for example amongst those who might feel that the working class voice has become irrelevant (because they have no presence amongst the chatterati, or power elites).

Islam is quite different, and infinitely more threatening once the momentum reaches a certain threshold.

Obviously it can be portrayed as relatively benign in the UK, the odd tube bombing, and beheading aside because it is contained by the prevailing counter culture (secular democracy + liberalism) – once this relationship tilts sufficiently in favour of the religionists then quite a different picture emerges, as invariably demonstrated in other countries that adopt this particular model.

You might see no difference between the gentle, non-bombing, non-beheading mormons and, cartoon hating islamists but some western intellectuals beg to differ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfKLV6rmLxE

27. Churm Rincewind

@ 25: Of Mehdi Hasan: “I don’t think anyone who dismisses non-believers as ‘cattle’ has a useful contribution to make.”

But I don’t think that was quite the intention behind his remarks, was it? Rather, he was offering an explanation of the Koran’s use of the word “cattle” to describe atheists “because they’re incapable of the intellectual effort it requires to shake off those blind prejudices, to shake off those easy assumptions about this world, about the existence of God. In this respect, the Koran describes atheists as “cattle”, as cattle of those who grow the crops and do not stop and wonder about this world.” (His words).

A similar comparison appears in the Bible (2 Peter 2): “The Lord knows how to…hold the unrighteous for punishment on the day of judgment…bold and arrogant, they are not afraid to heap abuse on celestial beings…they are like unreasoning animals, creatures of instinct, born only to be caught and destroyed..”.

Whether you agree with this point of view or not, it’s hardly extremist stuff is it?

28. the a&e charge nurse

[28] no, Medhi Hasan is not an extremist, although he holds certain fantastical views about flying horses.

Maybe the quran loving Medhi could tell us why things tend to go awry whenever islamic clerics gain sufficient traction.
Has he been to Iran recently – according the Graun Iranians are preparing to vote for a successor to Mahmoud Ahmadinejad – on the ballot paper, there is a list of six men, all vetted and approved by the clerical authorities ……… sounds smashing?
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/12/iran-egypt-revolutions-islamists-control

29. margin4error

A&E

I see no difference between any religion. They are all wrong and like guns, in the wrong hands they destroy lives.

However – your personal view that Islam is particularly menacing doesn’t negate perfectly sensible criticism of the EDL.

Yet you decided to attack those criticising EDL as “weeping” for a “fanatical religious ideology”

That’s a bit like saying that people who oppose racism are defending misogyny.

‘We don’t want EDL with our Cornflakes’

Those calling for the EDL leader to be ‘no platformed’ from BBC radio hold the listening public in contempt.

This guy is saying (today) what I said yesterday.
Particularly the last bit:

And this is what the criticism of Robinson’s appearance on Today amounts to: a fear that people are unable to make up own minds about the content of what the EDL is saying, at least without sufficient guidance and counter-balance from right-thinking people.

I think I now hate the left. It’s kind of sad to admit as I always used to like to think of myself as being a bit left.

31. John Reid

30 can’t fault your argument Damon, I thought the loony left had been banished to TUSC, respect, socialist alliance, they trying to reinfultrate labour and trade unions,

32. John Reid

The fact spiked online had a link to Medhi Jason’s hiffingtoon post article without, even bothering to see if any if Hasans comments were factually correct, says it all,

I recall Damon yuo were banned from Billy Braggs webpage, despite as you put it being a bit of a leftie,

Trotskyites the greatest recruitment drive the Tories have ever had,

Yes, I was banned off the Billy Bragg Forums in 2009.
They regarded me as a complete racist.

34. John Reid

This was before it turned out Bragg lived in a mansion, the liberal dem voter , our local Labour Party Chair mick h, use to blog the before they banned him too, never bothered with it myself, Braggs a o.k bloke but he caused more harm than good when he turned up in Dgnham in2010′ as he so how spoke for the bloke on the street when he rowed with the BNP, refusing to believe it was labour arrogance that had let the BNP get in ,in the first place

35. the a&e charge nurse

[29] ‘Yet you decided to attack those criticising EDL as “weeping” for a “fanatical religious ideology” – then I have not made myself clear.

The EDL are so buffoonish that they hardly merit the sort of coverage they regularly receive on LC – they are a tiny group and are only relevant to the extent that they tap into working class disaffection (a subject which IS worth talking about).

As I see it the presence of the EDL is somehow used by some to justify, or at least counterbalance the threat from an ideology that is violent, chauvinistic (not to mention homophobic and antisemitic) goes back centuries and has over a billion adherents.

I’ll grant you that all religions are the same to the extent that they are all man made and all represent a form of wish fulfillment but the CONSEQUENCES are not the same, and for this reason islam stands out as a particularly troubling ideology, and one to be combatted intellectually.

36. margin4error

A&E

But surely better that they are discussed as a phenomenon somewhere like LC than given greater political credibility by discussion and a voice on Radio 4?

They are given coverage out of proportion with their importance. But extremists always are. Islamic fanatics are rare in the UK, Fathers4Justice were tiny. That’s the nature of news.

Oh, and while there isn’t a clumsily concocted “organisation” or “objective” for us to vilify, christian extremism – the bigotry that it propogates and the deaths it causes through violence and manipulation(from Eric Rudolph through David Copeland to the Wako siege and attacks on abortion doctors) – I suspect it is a little lazy to imagine Islam is somehow more terrible than other religions in this regard.

John Reid, Billy Bragg himself didn’t write on the blog, it was fans of his – who were a tight little online community. They were ”nice people” for the most part, some of them particularly so, but they were way too ideological IMO. This can happen because of the nature of open internet forums – like this one too. You don’t really know who you’re talking to, so safety is always prefered. Things have to be blanded out and made safe for the greater majority. That’s how the likes of UAF etc work. They go for the lowest common denominator, which appeals to people’s common decency …. like in the way they oppose ”Nazis”.

Everyone is against Nazis. Remember what they did in Auswitch? It’s a simple almost childlike line of reasoning. The EDL are ”Nazis” – and given half the chance they’d be putting immigrants in ovens … so they have to be opposed at every turn.

There’s no place for clever dicks – or perhaps secret Nazi sympathisers – to be questioning the main anti-fascist line and suggesting that groups like the EDL aren’t really all they’re being cracked up to be.
That can only cause confusion and dissent, and so has to be either ignored or swept away.
You can see this logic also works quite strongly on LC.
The EDL stories just keep coming, and people questioning the logic are mostly ignored. They might even be banned if they persist. I know this as one of Sunny’s mods banned me on the old Pickled Politics site. Basicly, if you go up against anti-fascists online, you will be called a fascist yourself and perhaps banned. I think the reasoning is that it’s for the greater good.

38. EyesWideStupid

Shrugged

You fool – Jiihad is an INTERPRETATION of the Koran, just as the Crusades were an interprtation of the Bible.

What Tommy Robinson says is not an interpretation – as he has clearly said it.

Are you really struggling that much with understanding the difference – or is this willful ignorance we see here?

39. EyesWideStupid

8. Baton Rouge

Isn’t it fascinating how the EDL are so focused on stopping the ‘spread of Islam’ – but not so fussed about stopping the spread of Catholocism – which hid Paedofiles, or the spread of any other religion for that matter.

The Bush’s started 2 wars based on their belief that ‘God was on their side’ – and yet the EDL supporters are silent on this.

I wonder why – is it only ‘brown’ religions we need to “defend against”???

40. EyesWideStupid

12. Cylux

If the EDL are truly concerned about Islam – then why aren’t they engaging in a theological debate to demonstrate that the religion (like all religions) are bogus?

Instead they seem to be suggesting the best way to get rid of a religion is to oppress it.

Now how has that worked out in the past? Do we have a shortage of religious martyrs and we need more?

Do not try to make sense of the EDL position – because it’s racist and there is no sense to be made.

@40 The fact that their response is incoherent and likely to fail has little to no bearing on their motivations for doing so. The EDL has a problem with fanatical Islam, they say as much, the fact that they pretty much associate all Islam with fanatical Islam, and resort to crude racial stereotyping in order to identify ‘fanatical Muslims’ does not really detract from that.

It is after all not hard to be motivated by a ‘good reason’ and then proceed to make a complete balls up of everything to the extent that if you were actually acting on malice to achieve the exact opposite, then you could declare yourself successful – I mean just look at the Labour Party’s latest ‘compulsory jobs guarantee’ for a fine example of that in action.

42. EyesWideStupid

41. Cylux

What ‘problem’ does the EDL have with radical Islam?

Were their members killed in the tube bombings?

Was Drummer Rigby an EDL member?

Even the name ‘English defence league’ – which not only excludes Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland (are we to assume they’re not affected – or that the EDL just don’t care about them?) – the people of England have a police force, security forces and an armed force to protect themselves against radical Islam. Why the hell would they want a band of merry amatuer thugs to protect them?

Their motivations are not ‘radical Islam’ – or they would be doing something to prevent it – rather than ‘creating’ more radicals to counteract their movement.
You cannot fight radicalism with radicalism and expect a good result – radicalism needs to be defeated by mass moderatism (i.e. other Muslims stamping it out)

The real question is who is not doing their job properly to defeat extermism? The moderate muslims or the moderate ‘English’ – or maybe both.

If you think the EDL are merely a ‘bad implementation of a reasonable complaint’ – then you seriously underestimate them and their tactics.

@42 – Regarding the name, there is in fact a SDL – the Scottish Defence League, which I presume has some sort of association with the EDL.

44. margin4error

Cylux

You say, quite rightly, that “It is after all not hard to be motivated by a ‘good reason’ and then proceed to make a complete balls up of everything to the extent that if you were actually acting on malice to achieve the exact opposite, then you could declare yourself successful”

But the first three posts on this page all attack the article with one form or another of “but islam is terrible too, so shut up about the EDL”

Now you and I probably know this is motivated by the usual “if you don’t cover absolutely everything on earth in this one article, then I’ll use that to discredit attacks on something I don’t want attacked”

But to apply your statement – one wonders whether those contributors would agree with you that Islam, being motivated by the “good reason” of showing us the light of god’s true message and thus saving our souls and enriching our lives – has simply been got a bit wrong by a few people who are thus “acting on malice to achieve the exact opposite” – and thus are not really deserving of criticism on LC (as they seem to conclude about EDL).

If you think the EDL are merely a ‘bad implementation of a reasonable complaint’

No not at all, my usage of ‘good reason’ was to provide an example of a ‘good motivation’ (in the example’s case, trying to help out the unemployed) which then resulted in a policy idea that would pretty much achieve the opposite. i.e. just because a person’s actions seem to be inconsistent with achieving their articulated goal doesn’t necessarily mean that they in fact have a secret hidden goal, it can just simply mean they’re a complete fucking cretin. The question is how much credit do you intend to give the EDL for forming Machiavellian schemes?

The fact that a fair portion of the EDL behaves more-or-less like a bunch of hooligans with the political nous of street thugs while blatting on about Islamic extremism and muslamic ray guns, just means they’re hooligans with the political nous of street thugs who are motivated by concerns of Islamic extremism and muslamic rape gangs. If 9/11 and 7/7 didn’t happen and there wasn’t Islamic extremism and solider funeral protesters to get worked up about, I’m sure that they’d have carried on being hooligans with the political nous of street thugs regardless, but critically they wouldn’t have formed the EDL and gathered together all other like minded individuals into their group.

46. Golam Murtaza

If Yaxley-Lennon and his fellow travellers really are such valiant anti-Islamist warriors I’m sure they’ll want to express solidarity with the families of the 1,200 Muslim Afghan soldiers who’ve been killed fighting the Taliban so far this year. But perhaps the concept of MUSLIMS dying in droves while desperately trying to halt the spread of Islamist fanaticism is too much for their little minds to handle.

But perhaps the concept of MUSLIMS dying in droves while desperately trying to halt the spread of Islamist fanaticism is too much for their little minds to handle.
—-

Please just stop it, I am not a supporter of neither do I give a shit about the EDL but its the above kind of thinking thats coming from little minds, or rather emotional reaction.

His “fellow travellers” are a mixed bunch of what ever turns up, from the educated and wealthy to those who can not speak, the main premise of his organisation is to confront the aspects of radical islam in britian (beyond terro) of which No one is doing.

Moderate Muslims who dont believe in cutting peoples hands of stonning people to death and killing non believers, who dont want shiria law imposed on uk citizens, who dont hate democraxy, who arent extreme, why do you feel so threatened?

Anyone? In the context of their numbers, are they nothing? I dont want to live in a society in which preaching hate to others is common place on a mass scale and luckily I do not, normal people know that its not the fault of “every Muslim” just as they know hate preachers only break through to a few.

I hope Muslims do understand, and do feel part of society. The EDL as a threat to the community is tiny, on the other hand there are issues we refuse to deal with, and pressures in society always express them selves at the bottom first, in those who are least capable of dealing with issues in a constructive way.

49. Richard Carey

Imagine how much more outrageous EDL would be if they were calling for gay people to be executed, husbands to beat their wives with impunity, apostates, blasphemers and cartoonists to be killed …

50. the a&e charge nurse

[49] or for rape victims to be punished for being raped.
‘Her rape emerged after her pregnancy test and Muslim elders in the village issued a fatwa insisting that the girl be kept in isolation until her family agreed to corporal punishment’.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/bangladesh/7073191/Rape-victim-receives-101-lashes-for-becoming-pregnant.html

But as long as the name of assange is not in the mix liberals can continue with their preferred ideological blindness – after all islam is not in the least bit chauvinistic.

The EDL irritate me as they are a distraction from the events that are quite shocking. Since Drummer Rigby had is head cut off a couple of hundred meters from his barracks in East London all we hear about on the BBC is that the EDL have had a march yawn, yawn, yamn. The EDL are just a symptom and a small one at that to the quite significant threat of Political Islam to the UK. Our politicians prefer not to see it for whatever reason (votes maybe)and choose to blame all of our issues on a couple of hundred pissed up footy fans singing rude songs. As Robinson said on his interview with Andrew Neil this morning, another atrocity in the UK carried out in the name of Islam will happen.

52. John Reid

Well. Said Paul, the idea that people sticking their right arms up in the air means they’re giving a nazi salute is rubbish too, I recall Scargill did it during the miners strike and the sun ,ran it saying he was giving a nazi salute ,with the headline Mine Furher

“Im not interested in politics”

“It is just street thuggery”

“I dont want to be another man putting a suit on and be sitting there lying, bound by political correctness”

“Its the politics of the street your interested in which is the hallmark of extreminism, facism, comunism through out the ages”

“Im interetsed in change for this country, no body that you ask will tell you that this countrys going in the right direction”

“I understand you are fightened of the threat, I think many people in this country are as frightened of you, we have ran out of time”

How much longer are these stale talking points and buzzwords going to hold for? Neil spent the majority of the interview trying to make out people should be as scared of the EDL as they were of extreminism through out the ages.

If the EDL guy was seasoned in debate, and performing under pressure, he would have wiped the floor with him. The majoririty of the points Neil made came across as scripted and foreign to the conversation, if people continue to refuse to adress a single point of theirs, even if you are against the EDL, its doing nothing but making it a million times worse..those kinds of talking points Will Not hold for much longer, and this simply makes the EDL more attractive to those who feel without a voice.

If there is another event and the EDL do a march within 24 hours of it and are interviewed on the street, they state they are out for their reasons and as blood still runs down the road near by a BBC talking head says:

Its only the streets you are interested in which is the hallmark of extreminism, facism, comunism through out the ages..

It has the potential to unleash hell..why cant this be seen??? Perhaps if 5-6 men were stopped when they started spitting at soilders, instead of smashing up the locals who turned up to stop them, the EDL would have never been formed in the first place.


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