Um, you are aware that the government doesn’t set the train fares, right? The people who control the fare prices are the franchise operators.

So you can campaign for the operators to reduce the fares, campaign for the government to make the operators reduce the fares or campaign for the government to renationalise the railways. You can’t blame them for the fare increases though.

I used to go to Kent uni and a few years ago you could get a single from Birmingham to Canterbury for £7 (advance, 16-25 railcard). I miss those days!

So they basically committed theft?

I shall now protest at the high prices of flat screen plasma televisions and walk out of a shop with one and only offer them a fraction of the price.

I look forward to you defending my actions.

1. George W. Potter

> Um, you are aware that the government doesn’t set the train fares, right? The people who control the fare prices are the franchise operators.

Um, you are aware that the fares are rising because of government policy? Specifically by reducing the amount that taxpayers contribute to the rail system and requiring passengers to pay more.

“Calling it the Great Railway Adventure, fifty-seven environmental protesters travelled to Canterbury on Saturday 16th April, paying just £7.40 instead of the full £27.60.”

Forgive me, I’m genuinely not with it here. Did they jump the barriers? How did they pay £7.40 for £27.60 tickets?

The figures here are shonky. An off-peak return from London to Canterbury is GBP25.40, unless you go on the high-speed train in which case it’s GBP30.20.

As the crow flies, that’s 21p and 25p a mile respectively – or less than it would cost to drive, even assuming you’ve covered the fixed costs of your car. If you’re travelling in a group of 4 people, then you can get a GroupSave ticket which cuts the fare to half that per person.

Given that rail passengers are generally wealthy than The Average Person (because the main function of railways in the southeast is to allow people to commute to London), it doesn’t seem unreasonable to make users chip in a decent proportion of the cost.

The best way to encourage sustainable transport use (both in the sense of ‘train over car or plane’ and ‘not making unnecessary journeys’) is to raise the cost of driving and flying to a levels where rail will always be competitive, not to bung taxpayer money at unnecessary hypermobility.

“The best way to encourage sustainable transport use (both in the sense of ‘train over car or plane’ and ‘not making unnecessary journeys’) is to raise the cost of driving and flying to a levels where rail will always be competitive, not to bung taxpayer money at unnecessary hypermobility.”

Let the poor stay put! Emptier roads for the rich now!

It is cheaper for me to fly to Athens than get a train to London (from Liverpool). That *has* to be absurd.

(Well, it is in the winter… Poxy holiday prices, bah.)

@ 3 IanVisits

“I shall now protest at the high prices of flat screen plasma televisions and walk out of a shop with one and only offer them a fraction of the price.”

Climate Rush’s actions are illegal, but it’s hardly the same, unless you can come up with a way of explaining how the high price of plasma TVs damages the environment and hurts the poor. Also note that they presumably didn’t benefit from the stolen journey beyond making the political point – unless you’re suggesting that the whole protest was cooked up an an excuse to get a free ride on a train?

cjcjc

I’m not sure I agree with you, but it’s refreshing to see you advocating taxation in order to subsidise state provided services. A departure from you usual stance.

imho transport is tricky – on the one hand, transportation is the sort of things I would usually like to see subsidised so that poorer people can afford it, on the other hand, if we want to reduce transportation carbon emissions raising the cost of transport is the first thing you’d do and also, as John B point out, given the pattern of usage, the tax payer subsidy most ends up making trains cheaper for well off rail passengers. I don’t know how to square all that.

“A departure from you usual stance.”

All things in moderation!

@6

“Given that rail passengers are generally wealthy than The Average Person (because the main function of railways in the southeast is to allow people to commute to London), ”

Hmm. Could it be that passengers are more wealthy than Avergage Person because fares are extortionately high? It’s cheaper for me to fly from Manchester to Prague than it is to catch a train from Manchester to London, for example (advance bookings depending).

Time to renationalise the railways (well, it’s been time since 1997… IIRC Labour promised to revoke the privatisation of BR back in the day?).

I don’t personally know anyone who disagrees with renationalisation except a few online commentators but it seems to be agreed that privatisation has failed spectacularly in this sector.