We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney


10:00 am - March 5th 2011

by Guest    


      Share on Tumblr

contribution by Neil Foster

Having spectacularly failed to sell off publicly owned forests, now the Government is attempting to open up our blood donation services to privatisation.

It will face enormous opposition from volunteer donors, health workers and society as a whole appalled at such a grisly prospect. Where you and I give blood to save lives, the privatisation junkies close to government sniff profit.

Giving blood is a virtuous act and a powerful expression of our most humane instincts. Not for Secretary of State for Health Andrew Lansley. His department want to privatise it to make the service ‘more commercially effective’. Nothing is sacred.

This is an important campaign for three reasons and one I hope Liberal Conspiracy readers will fully support.

First, there are real concerns about the implications of large parts of the service by a profit-making company. As that virtuous bond between the donor, the publicly-run service and patient is broken the number of donors will decline. Health workers are concerned that a private company will be incentivised to take decisions that will put patients at extra risk of contaminated blood as corners are cut and ‘costly checks’ questioned and training undermined.

We’ve seen the consequences of infection rates in hospitals as a result of outsourcing. Imagine the consequences of infected blood.

Second, this whole issue sums up the government’s devastating health policies in one corporate nutshell. We need to move beyond the technical discussions of commissioning and spell out the full extent of the privatisers’ ambition. The sleight of hand shown by Lansley suggests GPs will be in charge of all NHS health services. Not so.

The right to challenge clause of the bill (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/feb/21/nhs-turmoil-tory-ideology-run-wild) means that the real winners are the corporate leeches which will cherry pick anything they can make a quick buck from. This is already underway. Care UK recently won a £53 million contract for healthcare provision in prisons despite allegedly having no robust infection strategy.

Is it a coincidence that the firm privately financed Andrew Lansley’s private office in Opposition? We should demand an independent enquiry to find out.

Third the destructive dehumanising motor of the market must be halted. It will scour and search every nook and cranny within society for a chance to prosper. Boundaries have to be built. We need to re-make the case for public sphere, defending what builds society and strengthen commons bonds.

The fanatics in Cameron’s Conservative Party don’t understand this. They won’t resist. Just as they wanted to sell off every last tree, their allies seek to profit from every drop of donated blood.

In winning this campaign and we’ll not just keep a vital health service in public hands – we’ll expose and undermine the Government’s entire programme to sell-off the NHS by stealth.

Please join the campaign group, use the #bloodmoney hashtag on twitter to speak out and sign the online petition.

Let’s summon social solidarity, the motives that mean so many volunteer their time and their blood and let’s stop the blood money today.

    Share on Tumblr   submit to reddit  


About the author
This is a guest post.
· Other posts by


Story Filed Under: Blog ,Health

Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.


Reader comments


Blair and Brown if they ever meet again, they will say, god nows the time for labour to get back in, look at what we did not look at. Think of what we could do.

2. Chaise Guevara

“Giving blood is a virtuous act and a powerful expression of our most humane instincts.”

And there was me thinking giving blood was about donating a resource to save lives.

Look, the idealistic side of giving blood is important only in that it encourages people to donate. It doesn’t have value in and of itself. If it turns out that this policy really would mean that we got less blood, or that the blood we got was less safe, then it’s a big problem and needs to be stopped.

It may well be that this is a bad policy. But we shouldn’t oppose it just because we think privatisation is automatically bad, which seems to be the jist of most of this article.

Nothing is Sacred with this Coalition of Evil. People will STOP giving Blood as a protest but I suppose Greedy Business People will pay good money for Blood which will lead to higher prices within the Privatised Health Service which will mean more expensive Health Care and more hardship for the less well off. Where is all this leading ? Soon the Health Service when Privatised will be dealing in Blood Money!

If you are interested in Standing Up for The National Health Service there is an online petition being run by a website called 38 Degrees, if you interested or want to join the petition go to the following:

http://www.38degrees.org.uk/

Also At:

http://labs.38degrees.org.uk/wall/nhs

4. the a&e charge nurse

Give blood
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9yZIfz5-00&feature=related

And let’s hope we can give Lansley a (metaphorical) bloody nose?

5. Chaise Guevara

It appears that Bogeymen are scarier in Capital Letters!

How would privatisation of the blood services even work? Any private concern is going to need to make profit out of the endeavour, so when are demands for money going to be made? Will donors be charged for the privilege of giving up their livesblood? Or, more likely, will hospitals be charged large amounts to purchase blood they need to keep people alive?

Either way I’m glad I’m not a haemophiliac, I remember what happened to them last time someone decided to dick around with the blood supply. They’re still waiting to be properly compensated for what was needlessly inflicted upon them.

If, as you say “Giving blood is a virtuous act and a powerful expression of our most humane instincts.”

…and letting a private company run the service is evil incarnate.

Can I presume that the nurses who do the work do so at no profit to themselves – and certainly wont be earning a wage that leaves them with a surplus at the end of the month.

After all, profit is bad.

I presume the petrol firm that sells petrol to the mobile vans does so at cost?

The needle suppliers are so altruistic they wouldn’t dream of profiting from blood donations. The same for the swabs, the cleaning fluids, the paper suppliers etc etc etc.

Look, the vast bulk of any health service already is – and always has been – a private profit making enterprise.

If the NHS is so wonderful, it is in part due to those private companies you seem to loathe so much.

Personally, I don’t actually care what mechanism is used to deliver a service – so long as the service is delivered reliably, safely and at a sensible price.

If that means a private company, fine. If that means a civil servant, fine.

Ultimately, what is more important to you – that the NHS is a high quality service at an affordable price delivered at no-cost at the point of use, or that it is the last bastion of monolithic state control?

8. the a&e charge nurse

“Giving blood is a virtuous act and a powerful expression of our most humane instincts. – agreed, and it is very heartening to hear that some 7,000 donors come forward most days.

People giving blood, a health care system that is comprehensive and free at the point of delivery are both under attack – hell even the Liberals are finally waking up to smell the coffee
http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/the-staggers/2011/02/lib-dem-nhs-reforms-support

Brings a whole new meaning to working people having to give capitalists blood sweat and tears, doesn’ty it!

10. Mr S. Pill

Can anyone tell me whether this change is actually needed? Is the blood donor system so awfully run that it needs to be put in the hands of private companies? Or is this just tinkering for tinkering’s sake, with Conservative blind faith in public = bad/private = good once again winning the day?

11. the a&e charge nurse

Interesting item here on “red gold”.
http://www.articlesbase.com/business-opportunities-articles/selling-blood-is-big-business-713104.html

In the US, for example, blood banks collect some 13.5 million pints of blood every year, and they sell over 30 million units of blood products for about a thousand million dollars.

Interestingly blood banks never use the term profit – they prefer the phrase “excesses over expenses”.

Have you got that Andy “excesses over expenses”?

As a regular donor I’m dismayed at this. I will oppose it. It is utterly exploitative, people like me give blood altruistically, for someone to make a profit from such a gift seems immoral.

@12 Cherub

Do wake up. Read what IanVisits at 7 says. People already make profit from the health service. Those people they bought the mobile donor units from made them at a profit, those who supply the needles make profit, even those who provide the service do so to get paid. All those NHS workers who take a wage, they are all individually profiting from providing their service. Yes, including those saintly nurses. They are not just doing it for the love of the job – they are doing it to pay for their lifestyle too.

@13 MarkM

So it’s all OK then? Don’t treat me like a fool. There’s a difference between earning a wage and profiting from a gift. Or will I be paid for my donations in future?

Here comes Serco!

There may well be practical issues that mean that it is inadvisable to privatise blood donation. However, this visceral reaction against ‘filthy lucre’ even when it could help us get a cheaper, better service is just mad. If everyone is better off as a result then what is the problem with some people making money?

17. the a&e charge nurse

[16] “even when it could help us get a cheaper, better service” – 7,000 donations a day, gratis – how could it be cheaper?

18. Mr S. Pill

I often think in right-wingspeak “cheaper” means “someone gets rich” …

16. Falco

ludicrous and naive in the extreme.

This is all quite lovely but of course no one is in fact suggesting privatising the blood donation service.

What is being suggested is that the blood donation service remain just as it is, while things like delvery of blood that has been collected (already largely done by TNT anyway), or storage of it, etc, etc, be done by private sector companies.

http://timworstall.com/2011/02/17/privatising-the-blood-service/

There are excellent reasons why we don’t want to go to a paid market for blood donations (as in that post, the quality of that from donors is much higher than from paid peeps) but using a private company to drive the stuff around?

Seriously, this is the sort of thing you’re prepared to go to the barricades for? A little bit more of what we already do?

I think the end argument is how will all this end up ? I say this because all David Camerons Policies are ending up being something completely different to what he made us to believe them to be.

I dont even recall David Cameron having a policy on the NHS during the 2010 Election Campaign. I only recall him saying that the NHS is precious and that he was going to Ring Fence the NHS, in fact he spoke very highly of the NHS and how it had served his own family and that he owed the NHS is upmost gratitude.

I would like you to see an example of what David Cameron promised during the Final 2010 Televised Electoral Debate to demonstrate that he says and promises things that turn out to be something completely different. This example is when he says a Country/Society is judged by how it cares for it’s most Vulnerable in Society then goes on to promise if you are Vulnerable, Sick, Disabled, Frail, Old or the ( POOREST ) in society you had nothing to ” FEAR ” if he ( David Cameron ) became Prime-Minister. Please listen to the following:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4UvqmZlaAPY

David Cameron cares not for the Most Vulnerable in society and he cares not for our Health. He most certainly does not care for our National Health Service and how it operates. There is no telling what our National Health Service is going to be like after David Cameron cuts it up and turns it into an Organisation for profit over our Health!

Lets hope that a privatised service is better than the current service. I stopped donating when I had booked a specific time to donate and I had to wait for over an hour. Unfortunately I then had to go back to work.

23. the a&e charge nurse

[20] ah, pointless division of services so that it is nobody’s fault when things go wrong?

Remember when Dr Hubley died in a shiny new ISTC – when he was bleeding to death on the table there was no blood on site
“The surgeons wanted to ring the local NHS hospital and ask for blood, but there wasn’t a phone in the operating theatre. Someone had to go outside and rummage around for his mobile. The blood took almost two hours to arrive in sufficient quantity. By that time, it was much too late”.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/labour/6611887/The-doctor-who-died-as-a-result-of-Labours-ISTCs.html

YOU seem very keen to go the barricades so that a courier firm might get a bit more business – but is the abandonment of a joined up service really worth the sort of operational pitfalls?

24. DisgustedOfTunbridgeWells

@17

7,000 donations a day, gratis – how could it be cheaper?

BECAUSE I WANT IT I WANT IT I WANT IT OK?

25. Mr S. Pill

@23 hits the nail on the head, here. there are very good reasons for not outsourcing everything under the sun except the kitchen sink and especially in the NHS where times/communication between different arms of the organisation is quite literally a matter of life and death. that’s not even hyperbole in this case.

“In common with many public sector organisations, its call centre, catering, security, legal department and some office administration facilities are already run by private companies.

But under the new review led by the Department of Health and disclosed by the Health Service Journal, further functions such as the storage of blood and its delivery around the country – which is already part controlled by the courier firm TNT – could be sold off.”

That’s really not the same as the “OMG they’re selling off the blood!” of the OP is it?

27. the a&e charge nurse

[26] “That’s really not the same as the “OMG they’re selling off the blood!” of the OP is it” – the road to full blown privatisation is incremental and full of exciting new terminology like “excesses over expenses” [11] – today it is the fridges, tomorrow it will be the product itself.

Look at [21] again – who in their right mind would take anything Andy & Dave say at face value?

@17 Oh yes killer argument, gosh there must be egg all over my face…. assuming that all the facilities are free, and the staff are free, oh and the transport etc.

As I said, there may well be sensible reasons for not privatising the provision of these services but that someone could make money from doing so does not qualify as a sensible reason.

The level of hyperbole in this article and in some of these comments is hilarious.

What is the detail of this proposed bill? Youve said nothing about it.
What difference will it make to me as a blood donor, and to the delivery of my blood to the person who needs it.
Would these private companies be incentivised to recruit new donors?

I only know the process from the donation side of things but can imagine privatisation could potentially work quite well if implemented correctly. However it rarely is, often due to the sort of compromises which have to be made to people who believe in rubbish like that written in this artlicle (British Rail being a case in point).

Do it properly or not at all imo.

30. the a&e charge nurse

[29] “What difference will it make to me as a blood donor, and to the delivery of my blood to the person who needs it” – in time the effect of marketisation (of health care) will be to shift the emphasis from clinical need to ability to pay.

Er, why?

the US system charges about $200 a bottle: the UK one about £125. With exchange rates etc, about the same price.

32. the a&e charge nurse

[31] I think you might soon find yourself on thin ice invoking health care costs in the States, not least because they are highest in the world (at 17% of GDP).

Profit and extensive bureaucracy come at a high price it seems?

@31 Tim

Well for me it does come down to ideology, as I suspect it does for you. However even with its shortcomings there is one big difference between the NHS and private contractors, and that is openness and transparency. As I have said, the NHS has its failures here but is bound by FOIA. How many times have we been frustrated by “commercial confidentiality” when privatised services need to be held accountable? How does that fit your concerns about freedom and liberty?

34. Heather Lawrence

Shocking!

““commercial confidentiality” when privatised services need to be held accountable? How does that fit your concerns about freedom and liberty?”

Screw commercial confidentiality is my usual response.

“invoking health care costs in the States, not least because they are highest in the world (at 17% of GDP).”

Everyone always forgets a very important point here.

The US pays for almost all of the health care research, development of new drugs.

No, I don’t mean the actual research tiself, of course a lot of this is paid for by companies and or universities around the world. But in the seling prices of the drugs/inventions, the US is just about the only place that pays full market price. Everywhere else the govts negotiate the prices down.

Now that’s a great deal for us and the NHS of course. But someonw, somewhere, has to be providing the profits which make doing further medical research interesting to profit minded companies. And as it is, it’s largely that US health care system that does.

OK, maybe we might want to change that system too: but please don’t think that the high US costs don’t subsidise the research that we all benefit from: for they do.

There’s also a more subtle point about the deadweight cost of taxes. The US system number of 17% includes the amount that it costs to raise the money in insurance premiums. That is, all the costs.

But tax funded health care systems (the 10%, 12% of many other countries) numbers do not include that cost of raising the money, the deadweight costs of taxation.

Given that deadweight costs of taxation on incomes (which is what national insurance is and nominally at least pays for the NHS) are usually estimated at about 30%…..the numbers are actually a lot closer together than many seem to think.

36. the a&e charge nurse

[35] what about the $11.5 billion profits? – profits described by some as ‘excessive’
http://healthcareforamericanow.org/page/-/HCAN%20Press%20Release%20-%20Insurance%20Profits%202010%20-%20FINAL.pdf

You could probably transport the world’s blood supply for less than $11.5 billion?

For those who are interested in the Blood Donar service ‘The Gift Relationship: From Human Blood to Social Policy’ by Richard M Titmuss is a very interesting read. But be warned, you free-market freaks, you won’t beleive it and will scare the hell out of you.

[29] Competition in provision of a service is not the same as marketisation of it as im sure you know.

As is pretty much always the case in ‘privatisations’ of this nature the taxpayer still funds it and the end user will still gets the service for free.

What the hope is, is that it will be done for cheaper and more efficiently. In short a service run for the benefit of the user of that service, not for those that work for it, which is largely the situation in public sector today.

As i say, thats if its done well. Which it rarely is.

To add to [38] ….the benefit of the user of that service… and the taxpayer.

40. Mike Giggler

What more do the want – blood??

41. Mike Giggler

Hmmm…when making shit jokes I should learn to spell proper.

@37 Sounds interesting and I’ll see if I can track it down. However, if you think that people who support free markets, (rather than corporatism), are going to be horrified by the idea of voluntary collective action you need to learn considerably more about free markets and why supporters of them hold their views.

@35 Tim

“Screw commercial confidentiality is my usual response.”

If only it was so easy to make it not-so!

42
I do Falco, that’s why I gave a warning.

“35] what about the $11.5 billion profits? – profits described by some as ‘excessive’”

Snigger.

So, the US economy is $14 trillion or so. We’ve already been told that health care is 17% of that. That’s, err, $2,380 billion.

A profit of $11.5 billion? You want to call a profit margin of 0.5% “excessive”?

Seriously?

@44 You have given only counter-evidence for your assertion.

47. Richard W

@ 35

As you know Mr Worstall to ‘spend is to tax’. Therefore, all the public money that goes into the US health sector also has an embedded deadweight loss. They put about the same public money as share of GDP into health in their system as we do, but without the universal coverage. You know as well as I do that lefties who think the US system is a free market system are barking. It is not a national health service or a free market system. However, it is a bastardised system where monopolies abound that manages to create the worst of all outcomes. I don’t think it is a benefit that they do not negotiate and pay high costs for drugs. That is a Republican gift to the pharmaceutical companies which makes the American market the most lucrative in the world for pharma companies. Just one of the reasons why health care is so expensive in the US.

“which makes the American market the most lucrative in the world for pharma companies. Just one of the reasons why health care is so expensive in the US.”

That’s one of he points that I make above. The US health care market makes the profits which make the new treatments worthwhile to develop. So the research is all being subsidised by those Yanks…..which is quite right of course, as they are the richest large country and so should, in a redistributive world, be payimng more to create that research than everyone else, no?

46
??????

50. the a&e charge nurse

[45] perhaps you didn’t follow the link?
The $11.5 billion quoted was the amount troughed by just 5 insurance companies – I have no idea how much money in total was pocketed by shareholders from for-profit health companies.

The HCAN analysis makes for interesting reading – the CEOs at the 10 largest US health insurance companies as a group awarded themselves pay rises worth 167% compared to 2% for average American workers (same source).

You can make an argument that we should be replicating a similar system for the fatcats here (as per the coalitions strategic objectives) but few either inside, or indeed outside would agree?

51. Richard W

I see but disagree with your point. The US health care costs are on an unsustainable trajectory so something eventually will have to give. It is certainly not a free market concept that a big buyer should pay more unit costs so everyone else pays less. Although, one could argue that big buyers subsidise research costs and indirectly smaller buyers benefit. However, one has to assume that those who negotiated unit costs down are paying the equilibrium price. Those who do not negotiate will pay higher prices and this goes to the supplier in this case the pharmaceutical companies as profits and a higher return on capital. It does not go to the smaller buyers because they are already paying the competitive price.

“perhaps you didn’t follow the link?”

I did actually.

And the lesson I took from it was that if privately insured health care is only 0.5% (OK, because it was only some of the companies, say 1%, maybe even 2%) more efficient than an State run system, then the end result is that even though there is profit being made then the end result is more health care for less cost.

We know absolutely that this is true in some parts of life. A for profit food distribution system provides more food at lower prices than a Sate run one.

A for profit car manufacturing and distribution system provides better cars at lower prices than a State run one.

(Please do note, I lived in Russia long enough to really know that one about food and yes, Trabants are and were a joke).

We also know that State provision of some other things is more efficient than private, profit making, markets can provide. My favourite example is armies, where the Wars of the Roses tell us quite how undesirable the free market example is.

Out real question is where does health care lie?

I’m happy enough to agree that A&E is something better provided by the State. Mebbe….for I’ve been treated in a US hospital and an NHS one and yes, the experience was indeed different. Both times for a minor thing (in the US, nasty cut from a slicing machine, UK a light break of a finger, just to be complete) and the US won hands down on the “when will I be treated” even if the actual treatment for the same problem would have been the same.

Equally, that taking blood from unpaid donors, rather than those donating for money. Great idea, the blood’s better.

But whether it should be a for profit or not for profit storing that blood? Shipping it around? Testing it?

Don’t forget, from our US example we only need 1%, 2% increases in efficiency to make paying those profits a good deal…….

53. So Much For Subtlety

6. Cylux – “How would privatisation of the blood services even work? Any private concern is going to need to make profit out of the endeavour, so when are demands for money going to be made? Will donors be charged for the privilege of giving up their livesblood? Or, more likely, will hospitals be charged large amounts to purchase blood they need to keep people alive?”

Demands for money are made anyway. Collecting and distributing blood costs. At the moment it is hidden in the budget. Suppose that we worked out what it cost to distribute blood products, found a private company willing to do it for less, and let them. How would that be a bad thing? You don’t think hospitals should be charged for the amounts of blood they purchase now?

“Either way I’m glad I’m not a haemophiliac, I remember what happened to them last time someone decided to dick around with the blood supply. They’re still waiting to be properly compensated for what was needlessly inflicted upon them.”

What did happen? Oh that’s right, the public health sector delayed introducing screening either because they wanted to protect their own businesses (as in France) or because the government-run health care system did not give a damn. So lots of people got AIDS. And actually died. If you give the government a perverse incentive, they are likely to use it. Perhaps haemophiliacs would be better off if the people providing their blood supplies were not also the people regulating said blood.

Blood DONATION…it is in its title. I donate blood on the basis that it goes to whoever needs it – my blood. I donate it on this condition. How can this be privatised? Have I missed something here?

55. So Much For Subtlety

14. Cherub – “There’s a difference between earning a wage and profiting from a gift. Or will I be paid for my donations in future?”

People are not being paid for a gift. The proposal is that they might be paid for a service they provide with that gift. What is wrong with that? What is the difference between a nurse taking blood that has been donated and earning a living, and someone else transporting that blood and also earning a living?

If you think it is wrong to profit from a gift, go after the chuggers who are often paid a percentage of what they collect. Any number of charities that give a disproportionate share of their revenue to staff costs and so on.

Although joining this debate a little late, I am surprised no-one has mentioned the ethical factors here. Sure UD medical services make profits and agreed these funds help finance further research, but is it morrally justifiable? Is it ethical that a part of society that can afford the health insurance payments they need should have the care they require, whilst a percentage of the population (who tend to be the poorer in society) are unable to access the same quality of care.

No, with all its limitations (and they are plentiful), the NHS is a healthcare system that still offers universal care to all who need to access it. What frightens me about privatising blood services is that it then becomes a short step before we are forced to charge patients for transfusions. If that were to happen the consequences terrify me.

57. the a&e charge nurse

[56] “What frightens me about privatising blood services is that it then becomes a short step before we are forced to charge patients for transfusions” – oh, there is no doubt about – charging will be inevitable once we accept that the principle that profit is the most important driver of health services.

Here is a discussion about the cost of blood transfusion in the US – “It is estimated that a single unit of packed red blood cells (PRBC’s), with an acquisition cost of two hundred U.S. dollars ($200.00) has an actual cost of between one thousand six hundred ($1,600.00) and two thousand four hundred dollars ($2,400.00) to transfuse it to the patient”
http://www.ispub.com/ostia/index.php?xmlPrinter=true&xmlFilePath=journals/ijeicm/vol9n2/cost.xml

Well the CEOs of for-profit health providers have to earn their billions somehow?

54
It isn’t you who have missed something it is those contributors who are unable to understand the notion of human altruism. Giving blood, as you point out, has got nothing to do with personal profit or benefit and it is given unconditionally, no greedy self-interest.
Of course we need the rational planning of collection and distribution but without the absolute generosity of blood donors, blood products would be much more costly.

So Much For Subtlety

You happily ignore the differences for your ideological reasons. Either that or the glaring difference is all too subtle for you. So much for sophistry.

Chuggers? Good grief!

“Here is a discussion about the cost of blood transfusion in the US – “It is estimated that a single unit of packed red blood cells (PRBC’s), with an acquisition cost of two hundred U.S. dollars ($200.00) has an actual cost of between one thousand six hundred ($1,600.00) and two thousand four hundred dollars ($2,400.00) to transfuse it to the patient””

Erm, and the blood tranfusion service currently charges an NHS hospital £125 for a unit of blood. $200, £125, not much difference there is there?

And that actual cost of transfusion of course includes the cost of the doctors to prescribe it, the nurses to actually transfuse it, the equipment it is done with and even (perhaps) the hospital it is done in. What do you think that same number is in the NHS then?

I agree that there’s a huge difference between actually charging the patient this or charging the taxpayer this: but no one at all is suggesting that the patient should or will get charged it.

You don’t think that all of those costs go away just because it’s the taxpayer charged or it, do you? We still have to do the accounting, whoever is paying.

61. the a&e charge nurse

[60] “but no one at all is suggesting that the patient should or will get charged it” – why not, the US certainly charge – I mean at least have the courage of your convictions to admit that this is your preferred model.

Remember covert privatisation of the NHS began with out-sourcing of ancillary services – once the principle is established it only becomes a matter of time before the same arguments are applied to clinical services.

60
Ah yes, if it isn’t purchased in the cheapest market and sold in the dearest then it isn’t authentic.
Also, do remember that medical staff are trained by the NHS, you wouild need to factor in the cost of that training when estimating the unit cost of blood if private services took it over.

Is there nothing that the Tory vermin cannot look at and think ‘hmm, one of of big business mates could be undercutting the wages of these people and make a tidy profit from it’?

You people are hated, we do not like you and wish you would go away and annoy other people, i.e. your own kind. Please just leave the things you have no real interest in alone. What the fuck is so wrong in people giving blood anyway? Why is it that you scum cannot just leave things alone for one second?

Tories, for fuck sake GET A LIFE.

You people are hated, we do not like you and wish you would go away and annoy other people, i.e. your own kind. Please just leave the things you have no real interest in alone.

Excellent rant Jim, but I think the Tory vermin would respond that, providing money levied from them in tax is being used to run services, they are entitled to have an opinion on the value for money being attained.

And as the scum are running the government they are somewhat entitled to implement their verminous policies.

No?

“60] “but no one at all is suggesting that the patient should or will get charged it” – why not, the US certainly charge – I mean at least have the courage of your convictions to admit that this is your preferred model.”

Oh, that’s great. So now I’m responsible for the opinions of some caricature of me that you’ve invented rather than for my own opinions?

Do note that in the US it isn’t normally the patient that gets charged for it. It’s the insurance company, Medicaid or Medicare (usually).

65
And of course insurance premiums are free aren’t they?

“And of course insurance premiums are free aren’t they?”

You think taxes are free?

67
No, but I don’t make misleading comments about who pays for healthcare in the US.

So once everything within the National Health Service is privatised there is nothing to stop Taxes going up to pay for Health Care in what ever way, shape or form it will be in. David Camerons Financial Backers and Buddies stand to make a killing out of the Health Care System once it is Broken Up/Sold off at a give away price or simply Given Away/ and privatised.

The most vulnerable and poor in society will probably end up having to pay into it and end up having slap dash treatment if this new Health Care System is not financed by Tax Payers money.

No one within Government themselves know how these Half Baked ideas to Privatise the National Health Service is going to end up. Personally I think that this entire matter will end up like everything else David Cameron says : it will be something completely different to what he led us to believe it to be. The man is a Deceitful Liar for gain.

Pagar @ 64

I pay tax too, Pagar. The difference is that I accept that paying tax ensures that services are provided. Your average Tory couldn’t give a toss about those services (not until a loved one has lost several pints of blood anyway) and would happily see every ‘public sevice’ destroyed. That is fair enough, but why bother trying to bring down the blood transfusion service? What possible benefit do we get when the blood transufusion service goes tits up and the people who working it get launched into touch?

What kind of person looks at the work done by that service and seeths at the idea that the lorry driver is getting too much money or the nurse gets sick pay? Really, is that just so hard to take for these fanatics?

@70

“What kind of person looks at the work done by that service and seeths at the idea that the lorry driver is getting too much money or the nurse gets sick pay?”

The sort of person who believes that public spending should be value for money. If it is possible to provide the same quality of serivce for less cost of course it should be done.

71
I doubt if lorry drivers are being paid too much and there is a very good reason why nurses and other medical/health staff in the NHS get sick pay – it’s to protect members of the public, so when someone becomes infected by a virus they can stay away from situations where it could spread and contaminate people/products which can then infect the sick and vulnerable.

@72,

I was just quoting Jim. Any privatisation would not ban paying nurses sick pay – employment legislation would not allow it. My point is that outsourcing/privaisation should be considered if it provides a service of the same quality or greater for less money.

Jim was just making a total hysterical rant.

@ 73

Hardly hysterical. Sheez, just cause he has some integrity!

Please give me an example of a private service that is run so blindly well and cheaply, that the public service was a waste of time?

Yes, yes our trains run so well don’t they the French would tres jealous!

The problem with this mental country and equally mental stupid public is that we don’t do anything half way decent and are obsessed with chasing the bottom line with the long term objectives ahead.

When it comes to a service that people HAVE to use, not CHOOSE to use, man you ethically and smartly don’t mess around with it so your mates, again, can win the procurement and of course that elite 10% gets richer and richer.

Heck, just read an issue of private eye, same names are board members in the same companies.

Now if they opened this up to non gigantic corporate companies that have funded the Tories, then I would believe they have the publics best interest at heart and their pockets.

Hang on, something’s missing here.

Oh yes, that’s right, the fact that donated blood has been sold to Private Clinics for a profit for YEARS!

This is not a new measure, nor is it something the “Coalition of Evil” has introduced, this was going on while Blair and Brown were in office. Petitions have been circling for years to prevent this, but nothing was done. I only found out about this myself when I went to donate blood when I was 21 (7 years ago), I asked rather innocently whether my blood will help someone in the NHS, and I was told that it was likely to be sold. Which is why from that point I refuse to donate.

Funny how certain media circles with a certain political agenda are making noises about it now, and not while “their guys” were in power, eh?

76. Penelope Johnson

The government is clearly intent on destroying the underlying principle of social responsibility for all that underlies our public sector. Privatisation does not automatically result in better service, we are just fooled into thinking that it does by the “Every little counts” marketing. There is no evidence that a private blood donation service would do a better job. It must not happen.

77. Alistair Simpson

The proposed privatisation does not even pretend to be the result of evaluating the best response to an analysis which has identified a problem. It is simply the arrogant imposition of political dogma regardless of the consequences. The government has no democratic mandate whatsoever for carrying it out. Without Clegg’s collaboration none of this can happen. Wake up Liberal Democrats – you are being betrayed by your leaders! Make it clear to them that you will not vote with them or for them.


Reactions: Twitter, blogs
  1. Liberal Conspiracy

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  2. kirst

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  3. Crimson Crip

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  4. Kelvin John Edge

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  5. Liza Harding

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  6. neilrfoster

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  7. Geoffrey Pearson

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/AzQ6Ozc via @libcon

  8. neilrfoster

    Privatising the National Blood Service should be the next government u-turn. My thoughts @libcon here http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  9. Dave Harris

    Fuck me, it gets worse… RT @libcon We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  10. Gideon Calder

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  11. Ian 'Cat' Vincent

    We need to stop UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney
    http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  12. Lauren G

    Morning read: http://goo.gl/D3lvq Stop the #bloodmoney. And sign the petition: http://goo.gl/D6JDK

  13. Phil BC

    Only just seen this. Shocking. http://is.gd/zhvRsd #bloodmoney

  14. Sean Fraser

    http://t.co/aN5IEW8 govt dealing in #bloodmoney?

  15. Lauren G

    @Ceilidhann Mrrnn. Enjoy your early-morning (well, for Saturday) #FuckYouDCam: http://goo.gl/D3lvq

  16. sabele26

    RT @averyps: Only just seen this. Shocking. http://is.gd/zhvRsd #bloodmoney

  17. Alex Collins

    RT @libcon We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  18. sunny hundal

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  19. Heather McRobie

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  20. Tim Ireland

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  21. lewsosnhs

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  22. Eileen Allen

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  23. meshigener hobson

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  24. Jonathan Taylor

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  25. Amanda Ramsay

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  26. UNISON - the union

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon

  27. Save The NHS

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | by @neilrfoster http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon #savethenhs

  28. James Anthony

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  29. wendy griffiths

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  30. Declan Burns

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  31. Achille Dunne

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  32. nordin pumbaya

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  33. Lynn Hancock

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  34. Brummie Protestor

    RT @SaveTheNHS: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | by @neilrfoster http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon …

  35. Lynn Hancock

    RT @SaveTheNHS: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | by @neilrfoster http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon …

  36. Matthew Reeve

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  37. Horatio B Tabernacle

    RT @catvincent: We need to stop UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney
    http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  38. Kemi

    Stop the government privatising blood donations – http://t.co/2GwqlWt @save_our_nhs @orimeissa @schembrox via @sunny_hundal #bloodmoney

  39. Mark Martin

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  40. Martin Eve

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  41. mary murphy

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  42. Natacha Kennedy

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  43. Peter Oliver

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  44. Peter Oliver

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  45. Spiraltwist

    RT @catvincent: We need to stop UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney
    http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  46. unionjack uk

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  47. Abi O

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  48. remotevoices

    RT @catvincent: We need to stop UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney
    http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  49. Newro WGB

    RT @catvincent: We need to stop UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney
    http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  50. Matthew McGregor

    Solid stuff on why we've got to stop the Govt privatising the blood service by @neilrfoster – http://bit.ly/fXJ13R #bloodmoney

  51. wendy griffiths

    RT @mcgregormt: Solid stuff on why we've got to stop the Govt privatising the blood service by @neilrfoster – http://bit.ly/fXJ13R #bloo …

  52. Nick H.

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  53. Nick H.

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  54. Captain Blimey

    RT @SaveTheNHS: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | by @neilrfoster http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon …

  55. UNISON East Midlands

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://is.gd/lhYZUN

  56. ipodthereforipoor

    RT @UNISONEastMids: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://is.gd/lhYZUN

  57. L DTUC

    RT @UNISONEastMids: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://is.gd/lhYZUN

  58. Adam Hodgson

    #bloodmoney Was wrong its not our grannies they want to sell now its our blood.How low can they go? #youvebeenConDem'd http://bit.ly/eu7sbT

  59. simon trott

    RT @unisontweets: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @l …

  60. Max Freedman

    RT @mcgregormt: Why we've got to stop the Govt privatising the blood service by @neilrfoster – http://bit.ly/fXJ13R #bloodmoney

  61. Dom Baker

    RT @screechin: Cheers dude. On it.. RT @shugyokem Stop the government privatising blood donations – http://t.co/2GwqlWt @save_our_nhs #b …

  62. Kelvin John Edge

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  63. unisonleicspol

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  64. Chris Salter

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://tinyurl.com/68p269s #ppnuk

  65. Carla

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  66. CR

    RT @SaveTheNHS: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | by @neilrfoster http://t.co/w8aUSOm via @libcon …

  67. False Economy

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  68. Christine Ramsbottom

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  69. manishta sunnia

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  70. AdamRamsay

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  71. Lady STum

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  72. Peter Pannier

    RT @AdamRamsay: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  73. Joseph O'Brien

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  74. wwuncut

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  75. Sam Jole

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  76. Pete

    RT @sunny_hundal: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations says @neilfoster – http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  77. Enrique Valera

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  78. Sandra

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  79. Lesley

    YES Indeed to this
    @libcon: We need to stop the UK government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv /via @FalseEcon

  80. Nick H.

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  81. Ira

    RT @AdamRamsay: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  82. Lucie Hyndley

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  83. Lucie Hyndley

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  84. john king

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/aRSTYSy via @libcon

  85. john king

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/aRSTYSy via @libcon

  86. Martin McGrath

    Just when you thought the government was running out of stupid ideas they plan to privatise the blood donation service: http://bit.ly/fAfDHw

  87. Annabelle

    RT @Pandorasboxheal: RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  88. barnet_unison

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  89. Ray Sirotkin

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  90. Caroline Orr

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  91. andy

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  92. Rick Booth

    One I can support http://liberalconspiracy.org/2011/03/05/stop-the-government-privatising-blood-donations/ #bloodmoney

  93. Michael Edmunds

    RT @rfbooth: One I can support http://liberalconspiracy.org/2011/03/05/stop-the-government-privatising-blood-donations/ #bloodmoney

  94. MCR Artists' Bonfire

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  95. Kate Webb

    Rothschild: "The time to buy is when blood is running in the streets" Tories have a new take on #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/fAfDHw v @gplondon

  96. freebradmanning

    Tory leaches privatising blood donations http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  97. Andrew Sinclair

    RT @rfbooth: One I can support http://liberalconspiracy.org/2011/03/05/stop-the-government-privatising-blood-donations/ #bloodmoney

  98. Kelvin John Edge

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  99. Broken OfBritain

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  100. professorpluggy

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/7ZXiID2 via @libcon

  101. mcdave73

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  102. Sian Davies

    RT @LucieHyndley: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  103. We Love Bath

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations http://t.co/Zfhs5cP

  104. Andrew Griffiths

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/IOCUIeJ via @libcon

  105. Sarah Punshon

    Extraordinarily, Cameron is now trying to privatise blood donations. Stop him: http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv #bloodmoney

  106. Janet Gyford

    RT @FalseEcon: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  107. Lucy Pickering

    RT @AdamRamsay: RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  108. dodgyhoodoo

    @Thessalian Saw this yesterday: http://bit.ly/fwtOfG

  109. sjcooper68

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/93tTOOW via @libcon

  110. Michael Lewis

    RT @libcon: We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/dGz1Gv

  111. Dan Hynes

    Andrew Lansley is obviously in it for the money, typical Tory #bloodmoney #toryscum http://bit.ly/g7cGPE

  112. pauline doyle

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/6MfJ2ra via @libcon

  113. Royal Photographer

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney http://bit.ly/feMO3G

  114. pauline doyle

    We need to stop the government privatising blood donations #bloodmoney | Liberal Conspiracy http://t.co/6MfJ2ra via @libcon





Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.