“I see hard-working contributors with many achievements, people who are qualified and intelligent and will add to our society, being spat upon while asylum-seeking scum get houses, benefits and free handjobs from the British taxpayer”

“Nor will I point out that, in the seven plus years we’ve been dealing with the immigration office, there has been exactly one occasion on which we dealt with a person who had actually been born in this country, exactly one occasion on which an immigration-related letter was signed by someone with any approximating a British name. (Yes, yes, I’m obviously a racist – but you try playing with the Immigration “Service” for years at a time; see how much you like being milked for thousands upon thousands of pounds under threat that your wife can be exiled to another country on the whim of some Sri Lankan immigrant who barely speaks English and then lecture me on the struggle for racial equality”

This is the sort of person you quote approvingly, eh?

Well, which one of Hayek’s or Rothbard’s books turned that one into a libertarian?

Or is it just that this is the sort of person your “blog” attracts?

DK

Support.

Legal jobs or illegal ones?

Sorry, but could you define an “illegal job” for me?

Taking the situation as it is however…

Let us look at bar work. It is an unskilled job (in the main); in London, it is mostly done by Eastern European workers.

The conclusion could be—given that it is unskilled work but that the ability to speak English fluently is an advantage—that British workers have no interest in working in a pub for minimum wage. Given that there are fewer job vacancies than there are unemployed (at present), the conclusion is further moved towards the idea that British workers are not applying for bar jobs.

Why?

Because either they are skilled and can get higher pay or, if unskilled, it is better to live on benefits since pub work will not pay much more or, in fact, less (after withdrawal of benefits plus tax) plus they will have to work for 40 hours a week.

Incentives do actually matter (although, as Chris Dillow often points out, people are rather bad at assessing long term benefits, e.g. if one is in employment for some time, even as a lowly barman, this increases the chance of better employment down the line).

Hence, as asquith quite rightly notes, the withdrawal of benefits that comes with earning (marginal deduction rate) discourages “indigenous” people from working. quod erat demonstrandum.

DK

At times, I’ve been on means-tested benefits & I’ve encountered people claiming them. It is a deeply fucking shite system which discourages people from saving money (as they then lose their benefits) & pretty much encourages people to stay out of work.

It should be made easier for people to drift in & out of work & extend or contract their hours. The past 30 years have seen a massive expansion in part-time & temporary work, but too many fuckers won’t take up such work as it wouldn’t earn them enough to be worth it.

It seems to me that the means test is what stands in the way of, for example, the long-term unemployed finding work.

Legal jobs or illegal ones?

Right DK, because there are so many jobs that if all “Britons” were to try and get one, they could manage that.

If there are fewer jobs than people applying, then there should be no jobs for immigrants. Right? Er…

David,

Is this the same minimum wage that you think should be scrapped?

Yep, that’s the one. However, I was trying not to open that particular can of worms by talking about additions to the situation that we currently find ourselves in.

DK

Is this the same minimum wage that you think should be scrapped?

Sure.

“The solution? If you were to ask me I would say that dividing us into majorities and minorities is part of the problem, and that we need a new kind of cultural politics in this country which sees us all as one people – one nation – rather than an overlapping and often competing collection of ethnic interest groups.
…

“The good news for the left is that a debate about immigration is also, at root, a debate about capitalism; mass immigration is a function of the neoliberal ‘flexible labour market’ which is excellent news for corporations and often very bad news both for migrants and settled populations.”—Paul Kingsnorth

“Racism is simply an ugly form of collectivism, the mindset that views humans strictly as members of groups rather than individuals. Racists believe that all individuals who share superficial physical characteristics are alike: as collectivists, racists think only in terms of groups.

“By encouraging Americans to adopt a group mentality, the advocates of so-called “diversity” actually perpetuate racism. Their obsession with racial group identity is inherently racist. The true antidote to racism is liberty. Liberty means having a limited, constitutional government devoted to the protection of individual rights rather than group claims.

“Liberty means free-market capitalism, which rewards individual achievement and competence, not skin color, gender, or ethnicity.”—Ron Paul

It seems to me that both Pauls are blaming the identity culture for some racism, and I suspect that there is a certain amount of truth in that (humans are still instinctively tribal animals and anything different is suspicious—this will change with familiarity, of course, as it has over the last few decades).

However, the role of capitalism in each is ascribed a rather different role. I find it odd that someone on Liberal Conspiracy would deny people the opportunity to live and work here (as Kingsnorth seems to prescribe—even if in a limited manner) and to improve their lives; whereas, of course, Ron Paul represents a country in which it is very difficult to get into at all.

If one is worried about immigration, then it seems to me that one needs to deal with all immigrants equally—thanks to the strictures of the EU, we cannot treat citizens of Europe any differently from the “indigenous” population.

To compensate, we are making it harder and harder for those from countries outwith the EU—even skilled and, to British society, profitable ones (some may know that I have an interest here, by the way)—which, to my mind, seems inherently unfair (and stupid).

Anyway, I’m not making a particular point really, just thought that it was an interesting comparison.

For what it is worth, however, my fix is relatively simple. Remove most Benefits, and remove the marginal benefit deduction. This would be best done via a Citizens’ Basic Income, which everyone would receive whether they work or not: this would be pretty low (low enough to encourage as many people as possible to work) and would not be withdrawn if a person gets a job.

Couple this with a high tax allowance—£12,000 would ensure that those working full-time on the minimum wage would not have to pay income tax—and you have a model that will encourage British people to work.

In this way, you would reduce the number of jobs available to immigrants and thus fewer would come here—lower benefits and fewer available jobs would mean less incentive to settle—thus easing the problem (if problem there is).

This would mean that the Border Agency would not need penalise, deeply unfairly, those who want to come here and work and support themselves, whilst also easing the immigration problem and strain on public services.

In other words, make the market as free as possible—especially by removing the disincentives to work—and let the market sort out the immigration problem. Incidentally, all of this would sort out the problem of those who will never get work, and who will, therefore, never be able to get better work, etc. etc.

DK

Let’s suppose there was another Group of people that wanted to protect their Identity, or just look after their own, would you hate them as much, would you want to drop pianos on them.

You see the point I’m trying to make is that does your hatred and Violence only extend to Indigenous British people.
Why is it that you want to kill people ( dropping a piano on someone would very probably kill them ) who may not share your point of view and do you think this is healthy.

Why not debate with the BNP, then the Million voters will decide if they will continue voting for them.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HxvqBT2aJnc

What the Hell is wrong with having countries and National Identities and Cultures and a unique heritage, this is part of the Beauty of life, this is what makes traveling abroad attractive, to see different culture, money, to try different foods.
By the time you lot have finished there will be no point, we will be left with a dull boring sameness throughout the world.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ0Z5i0M4-0&feature=channel_page

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/guest_contributors/article6488799.ece

Have a read sometime of the comments you make about British People, these are your fellow countrymen and quite clearly you despise them and want them gone.

And you want your fellow Britons to vote for Parties that share your views !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJ0Z5i0M4-0&feature=channel_page

A very entertaining piece that can be summarised with a single sentence: neither the political class, nor liberal elite understand the man (or, since it’s LC. woman) on the street.

I must admit I did find this observation (by Liddell) very funny.
“Nick Griffin campaigned against a backdrop of continual sniping from even more fabulously whacko right-wing opponents — some of whom set up a website called Griffinwatch dedicated to undermining his leadership. He only recently won a challenge to his leadership from people who considered him ‘too dictatorial’ (an odd complaint, you might think, from a bunch of fascists)”.

157 – Once again, Shatterface, we are in total and absolute agreement. Defeating the BNP is, above all else, a waiting game.

I recall the ringleader of the BNP at my sixth form, who expressed very vocally a desire for Race War, yet ten minutes later was commenting upon how “buff” he found a half-Indian girl of his acquaintance. When I inquired he informed me that no, he would not kill her in a race war

I recall the ringleader of the BNP at my sixth form, who expressed very vocally a desire for Race War, yet ten minutes later was commenting upon how “buff” he found a half-Indian girl of his acquaintance. When I inquired he informed me that no, he would not kill her in a race war.