Comments on: John Redwood: let the banking system collapse http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/ Left-wing news, opinion and activism Sun, 12 Feb 2012 12:40:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: Now that we’re owners | ToUChstone blog: A public policy blog from the TUC http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22240 Now that we’re owners | ToUChstone blog: A public policy blog from the TUC Wed, 08 Oct 2008 18:04:01 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22240 [...] have a strict policy of no personal abuse on this blog, and I now find  (thanks to Dave Osler on Liberal Conspiracy) that I have described John Redwood as a fruit-loop market fundamentalist. Can I just say that [...] [...] have a strict policy of no personal abuse on this blog, and I now find  (thanks to Dave Osler on Liberal Conspiracy) that I have described John Redwood as a fruit-loop market fundamentalist. Can I just say that [...]

]]> By: Darrell http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22225 Darrell Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:54:46 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22225 . .

]]> By: Darrell http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22224 Darrell Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:54:22 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22224 Well I think it is right to question precisely what we are getting for our money is it not?? Are we going to get regulation that caps bonuses?? Are we going to have savings guranteed?? We will wait and see but I rather think that the answer will be no to both so I see no reason to support this bailout.... 'Key elments of the tranistional program'!!! what rot....let's rewind, this is a bailout to save the system, it isnt a transition to anywhere I am afraid and will most likely fail in any case.... Well I think it is right to question precisely what we are getting for our money is it not?? Are we going to get regulation that caps bonuses?? Are we going to have savings guranteed?? We will wait and see but I rather think that the answer will be no to both so I see no reason to support this bailout….

‘Key elments of the tranistional program’!!! what rot….let’s rewind, this is a bailout to save the system, it isnt a transition to anywhere I am afraid and will most likely fail in any case….

]]> By: Diogenes http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22223 Diogenes Tue, 07 Oct 2008 23:25:34 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22223 ok Sally - how much are you prepared to pay to support the banks? All that Redwood is pointing out is that State intervention will cost money...and someone will have to pay for it. ok Sally – how much are you prepared to pay to support the banks? All that Redwood is pointing out is that State intervention will cost money…and someone will have to pay for it.

]]> By: douglas clark http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22219 douglas clark Tue, 07 Oct 2008 21:47:31 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22219 Paul, Correct me if I am wrong, I usually am, but my understanding of the 'bail-outs' is that the government has nationalised the banks in question. That in cases where there has simply been a run on money, they have taken a large equity stake. Where they have seen the possibility of the market managing it's own mess HBOS, for instance, it has bent competition laws in favour of stability. These seem to me to be reasonable interventions, however if there is no meaningful reform as a consequence of this, it will be a complete, utter disgrace, What are the prospects for re-mutualising B & B, say, rather than placing it directly back on the market? I'd like to see something positive come out of this, such as Building Societies returning to what they did best. With a clear law that says they can't ever de-mutualise in the future. Paul,

Correct me if I am wrong, I usually am, but my understanding of the ‘bail-outs’ is that the government has nationalised the banks in question. That in cases where there has simply been a run on money, they have taken a large equity stake. Where they have seen the possibility of the market managing it’s own mess HBOS, for instance, it has bent competition laws in favour of stability.

These seem to me to be reasonable interventions, however if there is no meaningful reform as a consequence of this, it will be a complete, utter disgrace,

What are the prospects for re-mutualising B & B, say, rather than placing it directly back on the market? I’d like to see something positive come out of this, such as Building Societies returning to what they did best. With a clear law that says they can’t ever de-mutualise in the future.

]]> By: Paul http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22216 Paul Tue, 07 Oct 2008 21:26:07 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22216 I'm not a fan of Redwood, but I'm concerned that the long shadow of 1929 is being bandied around by bank bosses who see the state as a source of easy money. The end product could be a bankrupt banks AND a bankrupt state with no more money to pay them. I don't know what the answer is but I'm concerned that we're seeing a whole load of money being thrown at the banks without more than a whisper of meaningful reform. I’m not a fan of Redwood, but I’m concerned that the long shadow of 1929 is being bandied around by bank bosses who see the state as a source of easy money. The end product could be a bankrupt banks AND a bankrupt state with no more money to pay them.

I don’t know what the answer is but I’m concerned that we’re seeing a whole load of money being thrown at the banks without more than a whisper of meaningful reform.

]]> By: Nick http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22213 Nick Tue, 07 Oct 2008 20:16:37 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22213 I think he's saying the facts fit his "bullshit" better than your truths. The thing about economics is that if you don't get it, it gets you! Not even the state can ban supply and demand. I think he’s saying the facts fit his “bullshit” better than your truths. The thing about economics is that if you don’t get it, it gets you! Not even the state can ban supply and demand.

]]> By: sally http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22208 sally Tue, 07 Oct 2008 17:03:15 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22208 Richard So what are you saying? Do you support Redwood bullshit or not ? Richard

So what are you saying? Do you support Redwood bullshit or not ?

]]> By: Richard http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22202 Richard Tue, 07 Oct 2008 15:17:59 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22202 "They will never except that FDR had to step in with Govt help" Only problem with that comment is that FDR's government help actually did they little to cure the unemployment problem. Furthermore America experienced a recession within a recession in 1938. US unemployment rates: 1930: 8.7% 1931: 15.9% 1932: 23.6% 1933: 24.9% 1934: 21.7% 1935: 20.1.% 1936:16.9% 1937:14.3% 1938:19% 1939:17.2% 1940:14.6% “They will never except that FDR had to step in with Govt help”

Only problem with that comment is that FDR’s government help actually did they little to cure the unemployment problem. Furthermore America experienced a recession within a recession in 1938.

US unemployment rates:
1930: 8.7%
1931: 15.9%
1932: 23.6%
1933: 24.9%
1934: 21.7%
1935: 20.1.%
1936:16.9%
1937:14.3%
1938:19%
1939:17.2%
1940:14.6%

]]> By: sally http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22201 sally Tue, 07 Oct 2008 14:48:19 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22201 I suppose you could credit Redwood for being consistent. However, this really is the bullshit that the far right believe. It is also what Cameron really believed until he got the job of decontaminating the brand. But it is the same belief that the Right had during the Wall street Crash and the Great Depression. They saw no need for intervention, and if people starved to death, well fine, that is free market capitalism. Just as they saw no need for intevention in Ireland during the Potato famine. They will never except that FDR had to step in with Govt help. What they love is the idea of the atomising of society down to individuals. Just think how worried the poor and lower middle classes will be if they are scared that their money will disappear in a flash. It will keep them on their toes, and make them much more likely to obey their masters. I suppose you could credit Redwood for being consistent. However, this really is the bullshit that the far right believe. It is also what Cameron really believed until he got the job of decontaminating the brand.

But it is the same belief that the Right had during the Wall street Crash and the Great Depression. They saw no need for intervention, and if people starved to death, well fine, that is free market capitalism. Just as they saw no need for intevention in Ireland during the Potato famine.
They will never except that FDR had to step in with Govt help. What they love is the idea of the atomising of society down to individuals. Just think how worried the poor and lower middle classes will be if they are scared that their money will disappear in a flash. It will keep them on their toes, and make them much more likely to obey their masters.

]]> By: Richard http://liberalconspiracy.org/2008/10/07/john-redwood-let-the-banking-system-collapse/#comment-22200 Richard Tue, 07 Oct 2008 14:23:43 +0000 http://www.liberalconspiracy.org/?p=1403#comment-22200 "PLANET Vulcan is obviously blessed with an advanced Hayekian economy" Hayek's early works actually explained how these sorts of crises occurred. He would have fingered the low interest rates kept down by the BoE. “PLANET Vulcan is obviously blessed with an advanced Hayekian economy”

Hayek’s early works actually explained how these sorts of crises occurred. He would have fingered the low interest rates kept down by the BoE.

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